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Jane McFadden:

Hello and welcome to ADHD Mums. In this podcast, we tackle the tough, often unspoken realities of motherhood, neurodiversity and mental health.

Hello and welcome to ADHD Mums. Today we have an episode on misdiagnosis and how people can get diagnosed with autism, bipolar, depression, ADHD, anxiety, OCD, and it’s just a big fat mismatch of acronyms. Today I’ve brought on Georgia Poletti-Moulds. Welcome to you, Georgia.

Georgia is one of the co-hosts from Going Loco podcast. So let’s start off with you. Can you tell us a little bit about you, your story?

Georgia Poletti-Moulds:

All right. So I have bipolar, but I have also recently discovered through my son going through the diagnosis process that I also have inattentive ADHD. I believe I haven’t been diagnosed.

So I reckon, in my opinion, that bipolar and ADHD would be one of the most trickiest to diagnose.

Jane McFadden:

Georgia and I are not clinical psychologists, we are not psychiatrists. So there’s probably nuances that, you know, obviously you should see a medical professional for.

I have also been diagnosed with bipolar in the past, and I think ADHD looks very similar to bipolar.

One of the reasons I went back to a clinical psych recently was because I wanted to have an understanding of all the different crap that I’ve been diagnosed over the years, what is real and what isn’t.

So the people that are kind of new to this, bipolar has got some pretty good mood fluctuation, which Georgia is going to explain. ADHD can look very similar because if you are hyperactive, particularly, we do get on a hyper focus or you’re having attention either way, you get on a really intense hyper focus, you can’t sleep, eat, all you want to do is that.

And again, how does that then play out with autism and special interests? We don’t have the qualifications to really teeth it out. You would need to go to a professional, but Georgia is going to explain what bipolar is.

So if you are wondering if you have bipolar or ADHD, you might be able to identify with what Georgia is talking about.

Georgia Poletti-Moulds:

I have bipolar one. So there’s three types of bipolar.

There’s bipolar one, which has the quite extreme high manic moods and also the low moods and also can have some psychotic features. Then there’s bipolar two, where you still have the ups and the downs, but your ups aren’t as extreme. You don’t go into the full manic. You’re just hyper manic, which is still on the go, but not as full on as getting fully manic.

And then there’s, I think it’s cyclothymia, where you kind of go up and down a bit all over the shop.

So basically I have bipolar one. I was diagnosed when I was 25.

There’s a lot of people in my family that have it, including my mum who was undiagnosed, but I believe that she had it and also my sister had it. And so what triggered me getting diagnosed was my sister actually took her own life when I was 25.

Jane McFadden:

Oh, I’m so sorry. Holy shit. I was not what I was expecting to go. That, that threw me then. I’m so sorry.

Georgia Poletti-Moulds:

Uh, no, that’s okay. It also threw me and sent me into a full-on episode.

And so the psychiatrist, which was her psychiatrist as well, was like, yeah, you’ve got bipolar. Cause I went in and I’m like, you know, there’s something wrong with me. It’s the same as when I was 16.

Cause I had a bit of depression in my teen years. I’m like, give me the antidepressants. And he goes, no, Georgia, you’re manic.

You’re going to need some different medications, some antipsychotics. I’d been up for like five days or something without any sleep. And yeah, you just can’t rest.

You’re just talking nonstop. Your mind is going nonstop and you just feel really up and elevated. And yeah, it’s a strange feeling, like everything’s making sense.

Jane McFadden:

So when you were talking about being manic, have you ever experienced a hyper-focus from your ADHD? Like, does it feel similar or different or?

Georgia Poletti-Moulds:

Yeah, it feels different. I think that there’s definitely crossover because literally one of the symptoms of mania is like goal-oriented activities and like special projects.

So, you know, you can get very obsessed with a project, you know, like people can think, oh, I’m starting a new business, I’m doing this.

For me, it tends to revolve around kind of creative stuff. I dipped into doing a bit of standup comedy. That was my latest one that I was like, I’m doing that. And I did go and do some open mic nights and it’s still something I’m interested in.

But yeah, I feel there definitely would be a crossover with that hyper-focus and like the Venn diagram of bipolar and ADHD.

But for me, because I’ve got inattentive ADHD, it’s quite different. Like the bipolar for me is cyclical. So, you know, every spring I’ll get manic, like without fail, it’s seasonal.

And that happens for a lot of people. It’s quite well-documented.

And I guess the ADHD is like a constant thing for me, like, you know, my mind wandering, forgetting tasks, not being able to organize myself, struggling with budgeting.

When I say not being able to organize myself, I mean, I don’t have an organized house. Like I’m not a very good housewife. It’s lucky that I’ve got a husband that kind of scaffolds with that stuff.

For me, they’re quite distinct, but for you Jane, you’ve had a different experience, haven’t you? With like getting misdiagnosed.

Jane McFadden:

Oh yeah. Yeah. I am extremely hyperactive, cognitively, physically in all aspects…

Jane McFadden:

I am extremely hyperactive, cognitively, physically in all aspects. So if I see something that I want to do, or I have a hyper-focus, it looks like mania because that’s how I am, right?

Recently, my clinical psych who comes and does our whole family, I was talking to him generally about slowing down and trying not to be burnt out and blah, blah, blah. And he knows me really well.

So he’s like, let’s just be realistic about what you can actually do. What does slowing down look like for Jane is going to be different to what slowing down looks like for everybody else.

So this is again, the power of a diagnosis, because he’s not telling me to sit down and meditate with a cup of tea. I’m not going to do that.

So I need to have like kind of something in there. And he gave me a challenge and he said to me, oh, you know, I think you need to look at doing something that’s not productive.

Have you ever been for a walk that doesn’t involve catching up with a friend or seeing a view? And I was like, oh no, that seems completely like a waste of time.

Anyway, he said to me, what were your twenties like? What did you used to do before kids?

I was blank as fuck. I was completely blank. And he’s like, what, but what did you do?

And I was like, well, I either worked 18 hours a day or I had a breakdown. And he’s like, oh, oh.

And I was like, yeah, I did like probably about six, eight months in a career that was completely random, off the charts, weird, but I’d also succeed heavily.

There’s a saying that how many hours does it take to make a genius or to make an expert in your field of like 30,000. If you do that right, so hard, intensely like I would do, you actually do become really, really, really good at something.

And so I would do that and then I would get too many clients. I would burn out. And then actually one time I did actually go to live in a tent, which sounds weird, but I didn’t want to be around people.

I didn’t have enough money to not house share. And so I preferred to camp because I just wanted to be alone and I wanted to rest. And that there is actually an autistic burnout.

And that’s because you’re following hard a special interest or a hyper focus, whatever. It’s actually not bipolar.

At the time I was diagnosed with bipolar a number of times and I never felt that it fit me ever.

And even recently when I did the evaluation again, she was still saying to me that the jury is out on bipolar.

And one of the things that she told me was one of the differences was that in proper bipolar, you do get a very, very low depressive state and you do go to some very dark places.

With ADHD and autism, depending on whether then the autistic burnout goes so long, you then can move into a depressed state as well.

But typically autistic burnout can be healed by like quiet time, sensory slowing down for a long period, turn everything off, simplified, low demand. That can be enough for an autistic person to recover.

And again, I’m talking typically, obviously, you know, if you’re in a burnout, you should seek medical help.

But she was saying that one of the biggest differences would be the level of depression and suicide possible tendency versus autistic burnout.

When I was in my burnout phases, there’s only been one time where I was in a very suicidal place. And that was when my parents continued to force me into school. So I was in an uncontrollable environment and it moved into depression.

In my twenties, I would then go and hide for months and refuse to speak to people, delete social media. Everyone would be very worried about me. I’d be MIA and then I would come back in full force in a different direction.

I didn’t take antidepressants. It was full burnout. And that would be one of the differences I would see.

What do you think?

Georgia Poletti-Moulds:

Yeah, I think so. That definitely does sound like a difference. I think for me, yeah, like I definitely get the lows.

The highs are more the problem for me, the very high highs, like it escalates very quickly. And we’re talking about days and days without sleep if there’s no kind of antipsychotics involved.

And that’s what I take. So instead of antidepressants, I need antipsychotics to keep me down and manage the moods.

Jane McFadden:

Are you able to take your antipsychotics up to then reduce the mania or do you just want to be in it or how do you manage it?

Georgia Poletti-Moulds:

Yeah, it’s such an interesting thing. So when I first got diagnosed, I had like a few hospitalizations in those early years, just because I didn’t know how to manage it.

First of all, I didn’t know that you’re allowed to titrate the dose of the antipsychotics. That seemed like, I don’t know, drug taking behavior or the wrong thing to do.

And so I got on well and they’re like, oh yeah, you could have upped and downed the dose.

And I’m like, oh, well, if I’d known that I probably wouldn’t have ended up in hospital. I’m lucky to have private health and a good psychiatrist.

So once I sort of got through those early years, I am extremely aware when it happens. And yes, it feels good. And you do kind of want to go with it because you feel the best you’ve ever felt. You feel the best you’ve ever felt.

Honestly, it’s the strangest thing. But now I know the consequences. As soon as I can’t sleep at night, then I’m like, bang, I have to up the meds, which I guess seems like an obvious thing, you know, you should sleep every night.

But as soon as there’s troubles there, I’m straight on my antipsychotics and upping the dose. I guess it kind of empties it, but you still do have the rise and fall over weeks.

But the medication stops me going too high and too off the charts.

And you know what really sucks as well, let’s just like be honest, because I had so much fun in my twenties when I could do whatever I wanted and I could like, not, I could just be, and I didn’t know that I was going to have a burnout and like go into a heap, but I could keep going because I knew it didn’t matter.

Now having children and a partnership, you’re like, you actually have to be a human being every day. That kind of sucks because I actually miss being able to chase. Sometimes I miss the freedom.

Jane McFadden:

Oh, absolutely. You know, it was confronting cause I did have a small episode over spring again last year and my oldest son was looking at me and he had this look on his face and I knew the look because I’d given it to my mom and sister as well.

And I said, honey, are you looking at me? Cause I seem like just a slightly different person.

He’s like, yeah, yeah, you do. And my husband describes it, it’s like you’re acting as yourself, like overacting.

I was looking at him thinking, fuck, I hate that he has to have that feeling. But then I thought, you know, at least I’m managing it. I’m not completely out of control.

But to see that look on his face was really confronting cause I was like, fuck, you know, I really work hard to manage this and still having to see him. Yeah. Look like that was really hard.

But I mean, what, what do you do?

My son, I always say I’ve taken my tablet, you know, because they always have a forgetful brain. And I’ve been forgetting things lately. There’s been a lot on and he’s like, when you take your tablet, can you take two? Cause like, you’re still forgetting a lot.

Georgia Poletti-Moulds:

Kids for me, like the biggest change that I had to manage with my bipolar was getting pregnant because I had to stay on meds. So I had to go off the meds I was on cause they caused birth defects and then switch to some other ones.

I tried to stay off them for a while. And that was a real rollercoaster ride. And then managing birth with bipolar because birth causes a big manic episode because of the hormones and a lot to manage.

So yeah, it was a lot to manage. And now throwing in realizing that I’ve got inattentive ADHD, that my middle son has it. And I think my older son has it as well, but to a lesser degree.

Yeah, it’s interesting. It did feel shit initially, but then I was like, oh, actually at least I’m not just a shit person. Like I thought, you know, all these things that I forget and things that I can’t do.

I was just like, oh, I sort of suck at life. But then you’re like, ah, okay. There’s actually a reason. It was then kind of validating.

Jane McFadden:

So bipolar, where did it sit with the medication and getting pregnant and all of that for you? Cause that’s a massive time in your life to have children and they’re not—

Georgia Poletti-Moulds:

Absolutely. Yeah. So my oldest son is 11. So it was around 12 years ago that I initially went through this.

And so initially I was on a mood stabilizer, which is also an epilepsy drug. And that drug causes birth defects and has a high rate of birth defects.

So I had to go off that to start trying to get pregnant. And then they were kind of like, oh, you know, you can keep taking the antipsychotic, but can you just participate in this study about the effects on the newborn?

I was like, oh great. Are you really selling it for me? Let’s just, let’s do a study on my unborn child.

So they said, but you know, we know it’s safe, but basically cause we’ve got no evidence to suggest it’s unsafe because the drug is so new.

But I actually, I had to keep taking it. They said, look, if you can try and stay off for the first trimester, that’d be good. And I did that.

And it was really rocky and I kind of went off and on, off and on throughout the pregnancy. Cause you know, that’s the way they’d framed it about the drug safety.

But basically it was a rocky road. And then I thought I’d prepared really well for the birth. I’d organized to be in a hospital that had what’s called a mother baby unit next to it, which is like a psych ward for moms and their babies.

And I thought, great, I can give birth and they can just like wheel me over to the psych ward and sedate me afterwards, like smooth.

But unfortunately it didn’t happen like that. It was fucked actually. It was really traumatic.

So I had, I guess, a pretty straightforward birth in that it was 12 hours, came on naturally, went overnight, two hours of pushing, and then he was out.

And I went onto the maternity ward and I thought, oh great, you know, they’re going to know how to kind of take care of me. But I was basically left to my own devices in terms of my psych meds.

Like I had some psych meds with me, but I wasn’t prepared that I was going to go really, really up really quickly.

And then I’d kind of taken all the meds I had on me and the doctor hadn’t written me up for any more meds. So I ended up having a night with no meds, no sleep.

And I’m like, can you please contact the doctor? Like this shouldn’t be happening. I’ve come in, it was really planned.

And they’re like, well, you’re not written up for anything. We can’t give you anything. And it was really bad.

And it took quite a process to kind of get me over to the mother baby. And by that time I’d had like a couple of nights of getting really up and really unwell.

And kind of through their negligence, I got really sick. Like I officially was classed as having postnatal psychosis.

It was in the very early stages of it. And it was medicated after that. So I didn’t have quite some of the extreme symptoms that I know women can have if they go unmedicated for a long time.

But it was so frustrating because I’d planned it. I’d gone in knowing what happens. Like my mum actually had postnatal psychosis. So I was really concerned.

And all the way through to the obstetrician, I’m like, my mum had this, like I have bipolar, like there’s a high chance. He’s like, oh, stop being anxious.

And he even came into the room afterwards and was like, oh, what happened? After I’d had this like massive panic attack.

And I’m like, what happened? What happened? What I told you was gonna happen. I’m so fucking sick of women not being believed.

Do you know what I mean? Like, it’s not like you’re saying, oh, I’ve been a bit anxious once 10 years ago. I might have a little bit of anxiety.

The fuck up was that nobody told me you need to have a psychiatrist in the hospital that will treat you. Like nobody, that information just got lost.

You know, they would just assume, you know.

Jane McFadden:

Why would anyone assume that you knew that? I didn’t know that. So I’m like, I didn’t have a psychiatrist.

Georgia Poletti-Moulds:

And I even went to see a psychiatrist before the birth who was the head psychiatrist at the hospital to talk about the medications and blah, blah, blah. She didn’t hook me up.

So come second time around, I was much more like, I just took the meds all the way through. Cause I’m like, you know, basically the symptoms that can kind of come out from the babies that they were discovering were quite short-term things.

They can have breathing difficulties at birth. They can be a bit lethargic, but it’s quite short-term.

So I was like, right. Michael was fine. I’m taking the meds all the way through. I’m not going to put myself through that.

Jane McFadden:

Plus you’ve got another small child to care for.

Georgia Poletti-Moulds:

So like, yeah, exactly. And then I was like, I’m going to see a different obstetrician because the other one was cooked.

So I got a different obstetrician. She immediately hooked me up with a psychiatrist at the hospital as soon as I saw her, like, you know, like should have happened.

And then my psychiatrist is really interesting. He said to me, look, he said, we’re seeing a lot of people having the same issues that you had in hospital where they’re not getting listened to. And they weren’t kind of getting access to the right medication.

He’s like, we’ve been telling people to just take their own medication into the hospital. He said, because you’re so good at managing it. He’s like, take what you need and then just tell them afterwards what you’ve done.

So I think the biggest issue with having giving birth is the losing of control because you know, I’m really good at managing my meds. I’m in control of it. I know when I’m up, I know what to kind of do.

And when you have to hand that over in a hospital environment, like I thought, what happens to the poor woman who has no fucking idea?

Well, she goes home with her newborn baby and her husband that possibly goes back to work. And then people wonder why woman does something.

Yeah. He completely goes into full psychosis.

Jane McFadden:

But then also though, you know what, Georgia, I’m just like reflecting on the fact that when you have a baby, like it’s generally a rough ride. Like, can we not just line it up and at least give people a fighting chance of enjoying a moment of it?

Because that sounds fucking awful. Why do you have to give the medication dosage thing over to the nurses and the doctors? Can’t you just keep it in your bag?

Georgia Poletti-Moulds:

Well, that’s what I did until my husband’s like, you gotta, you gotta tell. And I’m like, I suppose if they’re giving you other stuff—

Jane McFadden:

Oh, right. Because they’re giving you other drugs on top. Sorry, I actually had missed that point. True. Okay.

Well, there’s another area that needs to change in the system.

Jane McFadden:

We’re going to finish up there, Georgia. Thank you so much. I feel like we covered a lot of ground in terms of bipolar, pregnancy, multiple diagnosis.

Thank you so much, Georgia, for your time. The key message here is you are not alone.

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